2023 F1 Discussions

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Is that the absolute all time highest number of race wins?

Who had the harder job there? Senna or Verstappen?


I think Senna had the “harder job” since everything now is based on car electronics > more than the driver
 
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I think Senna had the “harder job” since everything now is based on car electronics > more than the driver
You're just here to trigger me aren't you
 
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Yeah, but... can you see Max not beating everyone bar Schumacher and Hamilton easily?
 
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If Max wins every race remaining this year, he would be third on the list. Not impossible.

Okay, Senna had the super dominant car in 1988 (in particular) but he was racing Prost!
 
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The total number of wins isn't a meaningful comparison, there are so many more races per season now.

The main reason it's brought up is because Senna is such a huge legend of the sport. So when his win tally is equaled, it's just as much a tribute to Senna as it is an honor for the diver who reaches 41 wins.
 
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The most Senna ever won in a season was 8, which was probably 1/2 the races that year. If Max wins half the races this year that will be 11, didn't he win like 15 last year or something?
 
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The most Senna ever won in a season was 8, which was probably 1/2 the races that year. If Max wins half the races this year that will be 11, didn't he win like 15 last year or something?
Again, it isn't comparable. As you rightfully brought up before, Senna had to deal with Prost. Max has nobody who can beat him in a fair fight this season.
 
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Little regard for rules, convinced they are the best, no heroes, no respect, raw untamed speed and pure racing talent. At least for me this applies to both Senna and Max. People love em and hate em for it. Max is now dominating and you can feel more people turning on him. Nobody likes a champion for too long. Had Senna lived and won 11 WC he wouldn’t have been the legend he is today. People believe in stories and dreams.
Wondering who was better than who or even who is the GOAT, has no merit for me. You can’t compare ages. If you were dominant in your era then you are one of the greats and that’s that. For those who claim that Max has it easy, without any real competition, they should know that never in the history of motorsport has there been such an abundance of racing talent in all echelons of motorsport. Only the very best make it to the top.
 
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I agree it's very hard to compare eras. But one thing that's more valid to compare is the top drivers in the same cars in the same era.

In Senna's era, there were many greats. Lauda, Prost, Mansell & Piquet were his primary yardsticks.

'84-'85: Lauda v Prost at McLaren - Prost was faster but they split 2 WDCs while together. Prost seen as better than the aging Lauda at that time.
'86-'87: Mansell v Piquet at Williams - Mansell unlucky not to win the WDC in '86, Piquet won the '87 WDC on consistency, but Mansell was generally viewed as better.
'88-89: Senna v Prost at McLaren - Nearly equal, they split 2 WDCs. But Senna was generally viewed as having the edge over Prost.
'90: Prost v Mansell at Ferrari - Prost easily overshadowed Mansell.

Hence my personal conclusion is that Senna was the best of his generation, but Prost was nearly his equal, and Prost was better than the rest.
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In comparison, it's harder to gauge the current era, because there hasn't been the same level of direct comparisons in the same cars.

Riccardo v Vettel at RedBull - Riccardo outperforms Vettel, causing Vettel to leave.
Riccardo v Max at RedBull, Riccardo is often a match for Verstappen, but Max viewed as better.
So does this mean Max > Riccardo > Vettel??? Yet Vettel has 4 WDCs!?

Hamilton v Alonso in 2007 at McLaren - the two are nearly equal.
Hamilton v Rosberg at Mercedes - Rosberg was very tough on Hamilton, but Hamilton still viewed as the better.

Max v Alonso v Hamilton in equal cars? Hard to say who comes out on top, but that's a season I'd love to see!
 
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The GOAT is the one with the fastest car. Period. 😉
 
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Hahahaha whaaat 😁 why?
I thought it was a joke initially 😁 Then saw it came from the offivial F1 site. He’s keenly into sports investing, football then now motosports 😉
 
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Riccardo v Vettel at RedBull - Riccardo outperforms Vettel, causing Vettel to leave.
Riccardo v Max at RedBull, Riccardo is often a match for Verstappen, but Max viewed as better.
So does this mean Max > Riccardo > Vettel??? Yet Vettel has 4 WDCs!?

This is the kind of thing you get on Formula 1 forums. Well driver X beat driver Y six seasons ago in the same car so that means he is better than driver Z because driver Y beat him last year.

No it doesn't.

I see little value in the WDC anymore. The rules lock in the competitiveness of the teams and so Max should win every year until 2026 when things change. Red Bull won't put a comparable driver in the second seat, why would they want to rock the boat. Much better to let Max be a five time WDC.

As you say, Senna won his WDCs against great drivers, including Prost (who lets not forget won 4 WDCs himself).
 
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Nobody likes a champion for too long. Had Senna lived and won 11 WC he wouldn’t have been the legend he is today. People believe in stories and dreams.

That's true actually. Terrible as it was, Imola really cemented the legend of Senna for ever. It's funny, you don't really hear anyone talk about Fangio anymore... and yet he's still third in the list of champions.
 
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Nope, he’ll be the last one standing.
Nope 😉 I’m pretty sure he has the fastest car (at that time) also 👍